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Small scale gliders. Do they offend?

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  • Small scale gliders. Do they offend?

    If I start a new thread about scratch building of small scale gliders, will I offend the populous of this forum? I do not see much here about anything much smaller than 1/4 scale and I just enjoy building in 1/12 and 1/6 scale. My enjoyment comes 90% in the research, design and building of scale aircraft and only about 10% in the flying of them. Even my small scale stuff is fully loaded and ready for immediate flight, I may never fly it. I just hang it up from the sealing of my office and there it will stay. Sometimes I will do a CAD plan, sometimes only a partial one and sometimes none at all. Depends on my mood and requirements. Would you gents mind if I post about small stuff? Or should I say; Will anyone reed about it?

    If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

  • #2
    You missed this one. http://forum.scalesoaring.com/forum/...erfect-mini-me This only has a 36 inch span.

    There isn't much interest though. I build all kinds of sizes but I prefer 4m and up. Next scratch build got me will be a 1/3rd scale Jantar Standard 2. But I like the fun of the smaller planes too.

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    • #3
      If it's a scale sailplane it belongs.
      Team PowerBox Systems Americas ............You can't buy happiness. But, you can buy a sailplane and that's pretty darn close.

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      • #4
        The Sinbad isn't scale but it sure looks scale. So it qualifies as a sort of scale. I loved building mine. I also built a 93 inch span Sinbad Gunny.

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        • #5
          I love the Sinbad. I agree with your statement. It is such a classic design, it should be considered scale. Maybe we should all get together and build one that is full size and than the models would be considered scale. I have two of the 93" short kits on order straight from China. They were something like $32 each including shipping. I don't expect to see them till maybe next month but it is not like I need them this minute. I plan on reducing the dihedral and adding ailerons. I would also like to build one in the 40"+- size range (I will call that 1/12 scale) Just for a back yard hand toss model. I do own, in my stash, a vintage german made kit of the Grunau Baby in 1/6 scale for some cold dark lonely winter. I plan on finishing my LF-109 Pionyr 1/12 this winter and starting either a 1/6 one or build a PB-3 Praha in 1/12 or 1/6 not sure which to do first. Most likely the 1/12. I don't know why but I really like constant cord winged gliders the most. Hence, my choices. It is OK if they have contoured wing tips. Such as the Sinbad has also one of my favorites, the Zlin Z-24 Krajanek.
          Last edited by GunnyK.; 11-23-2018, 12:15 AM.
          If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

          Comment


          • #6
            Here is the model I will be finishing this Christmas. I will continue the build on this forum and not RCGroups. 1/12 LF-109 Pionyr 100% scratch. I did some CAD drawings for this one. https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...r-project-ever
            Last edited by GunnyK.; 11-23-2018, 01:27 PM.
            If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

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            • #7
              That is a really neat glider. What will the wingspan be?

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              • #8
                I love it Gunny! Can't wait to see more.

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                • #9
                  GunnyK and SteveNeill, having grown up next door to an airport and literally under the traffic pattern of a full-scale soaring club, I have always had an affection for sailplanes and aerotowing. Add to that, my father loved airplanes and told me tales of the early days of aviation from the Wright Brothers up through the Goldern Age of flight.

                  The airplane gene was passed to me and I built my first model airplane at age 5, started flying U-control at age 12, and started flying R/C at age 16. Soloed Full-scale at age 16 and got my Private Pilot's license at age 19. Between being near-sighted and having a protanopic color vision defect, I could not qualify for any advanced license so I became an optometrist.

                  Along the way, I discovered that I liked watching airplanes fly more than actually sitting in one and flying it, so I deferred to R/C to fullfill my desire to fly. At age 17, I was introduced to Maynard Hill and a group of serious R/C soaring enthusiasts. The Cumberland Fall Soar for Fun originated from that meeting and became an annual fall event (just celebrated it's 52nd year). I was able to buy the property where this event is held in 1992 and deveolped the HighPoint Aviation Airfield.

                  From 1967 until the 1980's, the sailplanes were mostly purpose built, polyhedral wing, wooden airplanes. Composite construction then overtook the competition soaring community, radios and servos greatly improved, and smaller models (3m and under) were the rule. There was also a small subset that liked scale and those modelers discovered that the bigger the scale model, the better they fly. Scale models were not competitive with the purpose built sailplanes (particulaly in the size range of the non-scale models).

                  Non-scale soaring seemed comsummed by, and development driven by, competition. The subset drawn to scale soaring largely were not that interested in competition style flying. It was the visual aspect that attracted them and the bigger the model the easier it was to see (long skinny white wings can disappear into the sky very quickly). At this point, aerotowing became a serious matter for the large scale sailplanes. It was the best way to launch those 4m and up models.

                  The point is, the folks you will find here are attracted to the visual aspect first and foremost. We love the look of our scale models...and still appreciate a fine looking non-scale model. We are NOT giant scale snobs. Many pilots here with 6+ meter span scale beauties, started with an Easy Glider behind a Telemaster 40 tow plane...and they will gladly help any newbie starting at a similar place today.

                  Come to any of the aerotow events and you will see guys that own a trailer full of giant scale high dollar sailplanes helping a guy get into the air with his first foamy glider. As for build threads, we love them all! The creativity, problem solving, tools and techniques are always interesting to see. Even if we don't make a lot of comments, know that we are tuning in to watch!

                  Welcome aboard!!!

                  JimD
                  Last edited by JimD; 11-23-2018, 08:34 AM.
                  A Site for Soar Eyes

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    "I love it Gunny! Can't wait to see more."

                    It is a two fold answer to that question. If built factory scale it would have a 44.2" wingspan in 1/12. Doing investigating and communicating with modelers and full size guys in the Czech republic, (I am fluent in the language) I found out that after these were retired from the Czech air force aeroclubs and gotten rebuilt. It was not uncommon for them to get modified and have extra rib sections added to the wings. As much as two per wing. This is what I am also going to do. Add one rib section to each wing, therefore increasing the wingspan to 46" Because I have mostly finished the CAD drawing of this model, I plan on building it in 1/6 scale also. I do not know if I will stick to the original wingspan or also add a rib to each wing in this larger scale. I decided to adhere to the original construction form and not use bulkheads like the models and other plans of this aircraft have done in the past. All of my longerons on the fuse are Basswood and not balsa.I did not want them to bow under the tension of the covering material. I have decided to use Pellon 830 for covering. one 33% coat of nitrate and the rest in water based acrylic finish. I will use my Aero-Crylic acrylic based paint RLM-04 Gelb to paint it. This will reduce the chance of any constant shrinkage and warping the light airframe. My biggest concern has been the covering from the beginning. Now that I have developed a method using a combination of Acrylic varnish over Nitrate, I can continue to finish this project.

                    BTW This is one glider which I am considering, building in 1/4 scale. 132" will be very large for me. Fitting a 76" fuselage inside my jeep will be very tight.
                    Last edited by GunnyK.; 11-23-2018, 01:41 PM.
                    If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Here is a link to my launching system for my gliders. It should work on anything up to about 100+ inch span.
                      http://forum.scalesoaring.com/forum/...ill-do-the-job
                      If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Jim I can't thank you enough for the warm welcome and the great story. I can't tell you how many times I have heard the same or similar story story from full sized pilots and I never tire of hearing it or the variations on a theme.

                        I'm often asked by people without that gene, "Why toy airplanes? Wouldn't you rather fly "Real" airplanes?

                        You know how it goes from there. "They are real airplanes. They are just smaller and add to that you have to fly them from outside making it in many ways more difficult to fly then full scale...and so on and so forth. They never thought of that. Or how there wouldn't be airliners and trips to the moon without the model airplane because that's were it always starts. They aren't toys they are marvels! I suppose you can only imagine my reaction to "The Flight of the Phoenix" the first time I saw it.

                        Bottom line is (and you explained it so well) is we like to watch them fly, to see the dance in the sky and know we created and can do such magic that never ever seems to get old. And then there's always that, "Whats next?" and the grinning joy and excitement to build and fly that next project. I have never been able to get enough and I never will.

                        As for full size I'm slowing working on my training for my glider license. It's on my bucket list for sure.

                        Again thanks so much for the welcome, the story, and the help and guidance with this great hobby!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by GunnyK. View Post
                          "I love it Gunny! Can't wait to see more."

                          It is a two fold answer to that question. If built factory scale it would have a 44.2" wingspan in 1/12. Doing investigating and communicating with modelers and full size guys in the Czech republic, (I am fluent in the language) I found out that after these were retired from the Czech air force aeroclubs and gotten rebuilt. It was not uncommon for them to get modified and have extra rib sections added to the wings. As much as two per wing. This is what I am also going to do. Add one rib section to each wing, therefore increasing the wingspan to 46" Because I have mostly finished the CAD drawing of this model, I plan on building it in 1/6 scale also. I do not know if I will stick to the original wingspan or also add a rib to each wing in this larger scale. I decided to adhere to the original construction form and not use bulkheads like the models and other plans of this aircraft have done in the past. All of my longerons on the fuse are Basswood and not balsa.I did not want them to bow under the tension of the covering material. I have decided to use Pellon 830 for covering. one 33% coat of nitrate and the rest in water based acrylic finish. I will use my Aero-Crylic acrylic based paint RLM-04 Gelb to paint it. This will reduce the chance of any constant shrinkage and warping the light airframe. My biggest concern has been the covering from the beginning. Now that I have developed a method using a combination of Acrylic varnish over Nitrate, I can continue to finish this project.

                          BTW This is one glider which I am considering, building in 1/4 scale. 132" will be very large for me. Fitting a 76" fuselage inside my jeep will be very tight.
                          Gunny it all sounds good to me. Build the smaller one and enjoy it and work your way up to the larger build. As for fitting it in the Jeep you can. Once you remove the wing panels and fold the front seat down or put them between the seats up to the shift you can just make it.

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                          • #14
                            The wings are not the problem. It is the fuselage that will be tight. Even though it is a Wrangler Unlimited Sahara, It only has about six feet once the back seats are folded down and the front seat is pushed all the way forward. I guess I could always build a box for it and put it on my roof rack. I could build a trailer also but than you have the issue of storing that eyesore.
                            If it can't be done right, don't bother doing it at all.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Find some ceiling space and hang it to enjoy. I did.

                              Comment


                              • GunnyK.
                                GunnyK. commented
                                Editing a comment
                                That is exactly why I build the 1/12 scale models. The 1/6 and if there is a 1/4 scale model, will definitely get flown. I also plan to build a Zlin 126/226 as a tug.
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